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Post by robferguson on Mar 19, 2007 7:22:05 GMT -5
Late last week I was contacted by two parents with very similar stories. It seems that a CAS worker in Brantford has put up a fight against Canadacourtwatch's teaching of recording court and cas meetings. One parent produced an affidavit suggesting indeed the worker has fears of the practice of recording meetings. I advised both parents to continue the good fight and contact Brant MPP (for now) Dave Levac.
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litigator
Junior Member
The legal guy
Posts: 20
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Post by litigator on Mar 19, 2007 7:32:27 GMT -5
Maybe the Brant CAS worker would like to complain about Litigator supporting recording of visits and court hearings too. This is for all CAS workers reading this Board. The public is well aware of the suggestive and leading questions used by you CAS workers when interviewing children. You frequently submit perjured evidence to the court by way of affidavit and are rarely held accountable for your actions. If you people exercised due diligence when conducting your investigations and told the truth, people would not have to record you covertly. Innocent people have nothing to hide and would not care either way about being recorded. Guilty people immediately begin complaining because they know damn well the tapes will incriminate them. So to all you workers out there, you should be interviewing children on video tape as the police do so we the parents can see the methods you use to elict information from our children
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Post by darrensgirl on Mar 19, 2007 8:03:46 GMT -5
my worker and supervisor had told me to stay away fom Canada Court Watch saying its giving out false information. I have a meeting sometime this week with the supervisor over the letter I wrote to them about a worker change.
guess they didn'tlike the comment that the workers own personal problems are cloudy her judgement.
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Post by darrensgirl on Mar 19, 2007 8:12:56 GMT -5
meant *clouding*
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Post by ? on Mar 19, 2007 8:53:39 GMT -5
I'm sorry even innocent people care about being recorded, but when it comes to case workers and court keep taping. If you have a known history of taping wouldn't the people being taped just modify their comments, and then still do what they want. If I knew their was a chance I'd be taped, I would use that to my advantage. The recording can be used both ways.
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Post by ? on Mar 19, 2007 8:58:16 GMT -5
Dear litigator, Question? wouldn't the transcript from court be better than taping covertly. Just wondering. Stupid question? Why don't they video tape interviews with children? Is there a reason (legal) why they don't?
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Post by Dean Robinson on Mar 19, 2007 9:08:07 GMT -5
transcript are tainted and this has been proven by people recording their hearings, but the most importantant thing your missing here BMM2 is that in Ontaio It is Written in law that is perfactly legal to tape your own hearing
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Post by ? on Mar 19, 2007 9:12:27 GMT -5
Thanks Dean Who modify's the transcripts? Judges, transcribers?
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Post by Mary C on Mar 19, 2007 9:14:46 GMT -5
If the CAS didn't submit perjured and misleading affidavits people wouldn't feel the need to tape them. I told my worker I was going to go purchase a tape recorder and record everything, I wanted to film them in my house also to prove I had food, my home is clean, my child has clothes, they backed right off. They are like play ground bullies looking for a family they can target. If you are polite and helpful they see this as weakness.
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Post by ? on Mar 19, 2007 9:24:12 GMT -5
I understand why you would want to record Cas in your home. When they knock on your door you should film your home quickly, place the camera in a hidden position and keep taping the visit. Don't turn it off at all. Any edits will comprimise the tape for later use. Sounds like you know how they operate. Good luck
In addition make sure you leave the room a couple of times, you may get their game plan on tape.
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Post by ? on Mar 19, 2007 9:29:49 GMT -5
Has anyone have new information about the visually impaired women from brantford?
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Post by Mary C on Mar 19, 2007 9:42:31 GMT -5
LOL I know how they play the game, Dirty Tricks. They said I had an invisible dog, I found it so funny that I couldn't be angry. Instead I borrowed my friends pit-bull and yes I left them alone in the room with the dog. They were very nervous.
In 1 affidavit the worker submitted was so full of mistakes (lies) that her answering affidavit read worker mis-read file, worker mis-read file, repeat that 10 more times and see if the judge was impressed with wasting court time. Case closed, file closed.
They jump on a file with an over zealousness that borders on ridiculous.
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Post by robferguson on Mar 19, 2007 11:07:05 GMT -5
Has anyone have new information about the visually impaired women from brantford? i am also legaaly blind or visually impaired in the begining I was told my children were being apprehended cause of it. I scream charter issues and they then changed it. I know of a few visually impaired people around Ontario whos children have been stolen because of the disability. with the blind school in Brantford its amazing that part of their parenting course also suggest that CAS will diffently be in their lives they say for support. Hey cas Im visually impaired and i have a vision of an Ontario with a family services that services the family......
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litigator
Junior Member
The legal guy
Posts: 20
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Post by litigator on Mar 19, 2007 11:31:36 GMT -5
When a party requests transcripts in Ontario this is how it is handled. The judge is the first person made aware of your request. He then has the opporunity to review the transcript before it is released. Why you ask? Of course so he can remove or alter any damaging remarks he may have made. This is not written law but this is how it works. The most recent case I am aware of is that of Justice Marvin Zuker of the Ontario Court of Justice at 47 Sheppard Ave E in Toronto. The only way to ensure you have an accurate record of your proceedings with this type of misconduct going on is to make the recording yourself. SO the answer to your question is NO court transcripts are not the way to go.
GLOBE & MAIL - Oct 6, 2006 Judge to face misconduct probe Hearing ordered over complaint key remark deleted from transcript.
An Ontario judge will be probed for misconduct by his peers in the wake of allegations that he deleted a key remark from a court transcript. The Ontario Judicial Council ordered a rare misconduct hearing after it completed a preliminary investigation into a complaint lodged against Mr. Justice Marvin Zuker of the Ontario Court of Justice. The complainant is disbarred Toronto lawyer Harry Kopyto, who was prevented from acting as a legal agent in Judge Zuker's court last year on the basis that Mr. Kopyto has a reputation for being overly adversarial. After being excluded from the July 29, 2005, proceeding, Mr. Kopyto ordered a transcript so that his client, Robin Mayer, could appeal the ruling. He alleges that the crucial phrases underlying Judge Zuker's ruling were mysteriously missing. "I had to pinch myself," Mr. Kopyto said in an interview. "Did I dream it? That was my grounds of appeal. How can she [Ms. Mayer] proceed with an appeal if the grounds aren't there?" Mr. Kopyto said the case has important repercussions for the justice system. "He [Judge Zuker] is highly regarded among the judiciary," he said. "If he feels comfortable editing a transcript for content, what are the other judges getting away with? If Judge Zuker is doing it, then it's widespread." In one of several highly unusual twists, the case brings together two old adversaries whose initial courtroom clash in 1985 resulted in a milestone judgment on freedom of speech. In that case, Mr. Kopyto, who was already well known within the legal community for his left-leaning causes and his combative style, was suing the RCMP for alleged political dirty tricks on behalf of a client, Ross Dowson. After accusing Judge Zuker in The Globe and Mail of perpetrating a mockery of justice and favouring police "as if they're stuck together with Krazy Glue," Mr. Kopyto was charged and convicted of contempt of court. However, the Ontario Court of Appeal later acquitted him, striking down the contempt provision he had been charged under, known as "scandalizing the court." In subsequent years, Judge Zuker, a highly regarded specialist in family law, rose from being a small claims court judge to a mainstay of the family court branch. Mr. Kopyto, meanwhile, was disbarred for cheating legal aid. Mr. Kopyto's current complaint arises from a case in which Ms. Mayer was battling the Jewish Family and Child Service, which was investigating her treatment of her children. According to the transcript, Judge Zuker questioned Mr. Kopyto's understanding of family law and stated several times that the welfare of Ms. Mayer's children was at stake. "The best interests of the children come first; not who's right or who's wrong," Judge Zuker told Ms. Mayer. "At the end of the day, I may make an order that you don't agree with, and then you'll say: 'Well, I should have had a lawyer represent me.' What is more important in our society than the future of our children?" Mr. Kopyto's complaint to the judicial council alleges that by removing the reference to his overzealous tactics from the court transcript, Judge Zuker effectively deprived Ms. Mayer of her ability to appeal the ruling. "I believe that such conduct amounts to clearly improper conduct and, in the instant case, resulted in a miscarriage of justice to my client in the appeal process," he said. Ms. Mayer states in a document prepared for the appeal that she was "dismayed and appalled" when she discovered that the transcript had been altered. She said that "my life and family are being subjected to a judicial process before a judge whose apparent conduct has raised serious issues about the administration of justice." Mr. Kopyto said yesterday it is absurd for a judge to accuse a lawyer of being too adversarial. "That's a bunch of crap: Everything in court is adversarial," he said. "Lawyers are terrified to lay complaints against a judge," Mr. Kopyto added. "The perceived wisdom is that you're cutting your throat, so you just don't do it. For every complaint that is laid, there are probably a few dozen that should have been." Mr. Kopyto said that he had to fight hard in order to obtain a copy of the guidelines judges are given which set out the rules for editing transcripts; rules which specifically restrict changes to matters of accuracy and punctuation, and say that nothing of substance can be removed. "This judge thinks he can get away with anything he wants to," Mr. Kopyto said. "He did it with Dowson in the 1980s, and he is doing it to my client now. . . . In a sense, he was the author of my misfortune then. Now, I may be the author of his misfortune." Philip Epstein, the judge's lawyer, said he couldn't comment on the matter.
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Post by mary on Mar 19, 2007 13:10:00 GMT -5
well keep recording your own records as they will change them it is a proven fact and scared of CCW lol..too bad..the worker know the info on that site is correct end of story and the workers/cas have no right to tell you where to get your information they just don't want you to get it so you can fight for your children just ignore them..and tell them to mind their own business which would be child protection business .please don't get me started on these ppl ..
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