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Post by Dean Robinson on Oct 30, 2006 9:51:02 GMT -5
I started looking into the loacal situation when I heard Mike talking about council wanting to sell city parkland. I saw Joe being in favour. I also saw the Port Sarnia idea as a bad one for all except the backers. If the city gave valuable land and it didn't work out, where will we be. I don't think Sarnia can sustain anything like it. We need a large outdoor area to run Bayfest and possibly other similar events, Rock, Country etc , to bring in people. The Stokleys proved it can work and the point lands would be a bit further away from Front street. I remember coming to Sarnia in the early 1990's, things were realy bad, even Lambton mall was closing stores. We have come a long way. Don't tell me Bradley did a bad job! The local gouvernment is not in a position to sway Corperations like Bayer, Dow, Shell etc. Not even with dynamic and personable Joe at the helm. I will say Bradley has done his joband well but, like everyone else in life he has made some mistakes but we cant condem him this. 18 years is a long time at the helm. and its time for a change in direction. Are Joe Murray,Carlos Murruy or Dick Carpani the answer I don't Know. even the United States limits a presidents time to 2 terms. the nations that do not limit the time held in office are labeled as dictatorships.. lol now I'm not saying that Bradley is a dictator but we need fresh Ideas. so again I'm still not convinced to vote for any of the 4 candidates. Everyone that is reading this tell me why I should for for any of the 4
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Post by fumanshu on Oct 30, 2006 10:25:16 GMT -5
I started looking into the loacal situation when I heard Mike talking about council wanting to sell city parkland. I saw Joe being in favour. I'm not bothered by city hall selling some parkland. Personally, I think Sarnia is a little too greedy when it comes to parkland -- they require too much parkland. Sarnia is surrounded by parkland -- you call it bush, I call it parkland -- and I have to throw my support behind Old Spice on this one: A little dab'll do ya. Well, that's good to hear. Port Sarnia most definitely is a bad idea. I wouldn't expect to see the Stokleys move BayFest to another location anytime soon. When I mentioned BayFest as an example of a project, I was not implying that BayFest should move to the proposed Port Sarnia site. I was merely pointing out that BayFest is not a permanent structure. The point was that if BayFest had failed, there would have been no cost or impact to the city. Jim and Michelle would have just packed up their tent and gone home. When you have a permanent structure like the proposed Port Sarnia -- slight correction, I believe the proposal calls for several permanent structures -- it is not a matter of packing up your tent and going home. Quite the opposite actually, if the project fails, you're left with a burden. What is your hang up with the Lambton Mall? Lambton Mall seems to be your only benchmark for measuring Mike Bradley's performance. And it's a very poor benchmark as well. Mike Bradley had nothing to do with the rejuvenation of Lambton Mall. Their growth had everything to do with foresight, marketing, and ambition. Three qualities that were displayed by the owners and managers of Lambton Mall. The mayor had no input, no impact, and no part in Lambton Mall's growth. I'm quite familiar with Lambton Mall myself, by the way. It was part of my stomping grounds as a kid. I shoplifted for the first time in my life at the old Dominion grocery store. When the old Dominion store closed down, Lambton Mall introduced its first ever food court. Prior to that, the only place you could eat at Lambton Mall, was the Woolco restaurant, the snack bar at the movie theatre, or the one standalone restaurant in the Lambton Mall. I'm trying to remember which stores were closing in the earling nineties. So far, I can only think of Paul's TV. But that store only closed because of personal reasons for the owner. The Lambton Mall has seen many expansions over the years. I've no doubt that this mall will continue to expand in the future. For the most part, you are correct. The one area where local government is able to have some impact, is in the area of taxation. Also, the local government can play a big role in marketing the city. Word of mouth is not good enough. The city has to work harder. If Joe is elected on November 13, 2006, I expect he will seek re-election in 2010. That of course, is barring any unforeseen illnesses, accidents, or sudden death. Joe Murray doesn't strike me as being someone who is eager to retire. Besides, if he were to run for only one term -- who cares? I don't really think Sarnia wants another 18 year mayor. The Bradley experiment was interesting, but it's time to put an end to it and move on.
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Post by leisha1 on Oct 30, 2006 11:16:17 GMT -5
"""I'm trying to remember which stores were closing in the earling nineties. So far, I can only think of Paul's TV. But that store only closed because of personal reasons for the owner. The Lambton Mall has seen many expansions over the years. I've no doubt that this mall will continue to expand in the future. ""
Marks and Spencers had a large department store. There were a lot of stores that closed.
I was looking at pictures of our Car show in the mall in the late 80's and nearly every store is different now. We arrived in 1991 so we remember exactly what Sarnia was at the time. No jobs available as my wife was looking for a job. I tranfered here with Shell.
I guess if you always lived here it is difficult to remember small glimpses in time, especially from 15 years ago. It seems everyone remembers how rosey it was and blame Bradley on the downturn. The truth is the downturn was not caused by anything within the city's control. Downloads from the NDP and onservative provincial gouvernments. I know Sarnia is way better now than when I arrived in 1991!!! I voted AMG as I voted for 'change' now I see it would have been a mistake. I guess you stick with the evil you know or vote for change and live with it. Kind of like when the NDP won!
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Post by fumanshu on Oct 30, 2006 12:54:22 GMT -5
I guess if you always lived here it is difficult to remember small glimpses in time, especially from 15 years ago. It seems everyone remembers how rosey it was and blame Bradley on the downturn. The truth is the downturn was not caused by anything within the city's control. Downloads from the NDP and onservative provincial gouvernments. I know Sarnia is way better now than when I arrived in 1991!!! I voted AMG as I voted for 'change' now I see it would have been a mistake. I guess you stick with the evil you know or vote for change and live with it. Kind of like when the NDP won!That's right. When did Lambton Mall do that first major expansion? You have to remember that Lambton Mall had to force some store closures in order to begin their expansion. This meant that they had to refuse to renew some leases as they expired. This gave the illusion that Lambton Mall was facing difficult times, but the reality is precisely the opposite. They were planned closures that were necessary for Lambton Mall to build there major addition. And you're right when you say that Mike Bradley cannot be blamed for economic downturns. By the same token, you cannot give Mike Bradley the credit for economic recovery. Remember, it was Lambton Mall that marketed Lambton Mall. For the most part, they had committed lessee's before they began building their major expansion. Some of the store closures that were forced by refusing to renew leases, were moved to other places like Bayside Mall or other little strip plazas in the city. The Computer Terminal, for example, once did business in the Lambton Mall. They did not close or go out of business, they simply moved to another location at the corner of Confederation and Murphy. There's a lot of factors to consider when reviewing photographic snapshots of history. What looks like a mall losing stores, could, in reality, be something entirely different. Remember, there are two sides to every story. And, for the record, I remember the early nineties quite well. I left the city in 1992 and moved to Toronto. I moved back to Sarnia in 1993 because there was a job for me in Sarnia. I bought my first Macintosh computer in 1994. I was also a regular customer at Adventure Electronics in the Lambton Mall. You may recall that Adventure Electronics was one of the many new stores that opened up in Lambton Mall's major new addition. So, you really can't judge a book by its cover. And, while a picture may be worth a thousand words, the story can often be entirely false. Such was the case with Lambton Mall in the early nineties. There were stores that closed, but they were closed because Lambton Mall refused to renew their leases. That whole east wing of the Lambton Mall was the result of those store closures. It was a classic case of short term pain for long term gain.
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Post by leisha1 on Oct 30, 2006 14:56:07 GMT -5
'''When did Lambton Mall do that first major expansion? You have to remember that Lambton Mall had to force some store closures in order to begin their expansion. This meant that they had to refuse to renew some leases as they expired. This gave the illusion that Lambton Mall was facing difficult times, but the reality is precisely the opposite.'''
I do recall that Lambton mall even had to get into the farmers market business. Not while leases we being renewed as you recall.
I agree Bradley did not cause the problems and a more dynamic 'small time mayor' possibly could have done more, although I doubt it.
Sell the city is one thing. Getting businesses to locate here is another. I don't think any amout of salesmanship could have kept Dow or Bayer here!!! Joe may be as good as you say BUT!!!
A change wiould have been good, I would have voted for Boushy for change, he has the contacts and knows how to play the game. From what Joe speaks it looks like retoric from his Imperial Oil days. He talks about empowering city employees, Empowerment was a buzz work 15 years ago at all Oil companies as well as 'down sizing' since then they have changed 180 degrees. Joe it seems hasn't.
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Post by fumanshu on Oct 30, 2006 16:02:43 GMT -5
Your recollections of Lambton Mall aren't consistent with mine at all. Do you remember Woolco being an anchor store? Farmer's market business? When did Lambton Mall enter the farmer's market business?
Here's some quick information about Lambton Mall.
Lambton Mall is the largest shopping mall in Sarnia, with 629,000 square feet.
Lambton Mall has three anchor stores: WalMart, Canadian Tire, and Sears.
Lambton Mall also has two tenants leasing more than 15,000 square feet: Tepperman's and Toys R Us.
Lambton Mall had 99% occupancy as of December 31, 2005.
Lambton Mall will not see more than 7% of its gross lease expiry dates expire over the next five years.
Lease expiry dates for the five major lessee's are as follows:
Sears - July 2022 WalMart - May 2021 Canadian Tire - October 2016 Tepperman's - April 2008 Toys R Us - October 2016
Lambton Mall was completed in 1970.
In December 2005, the Primaris Real Estate Investment Trust acquired Lambton Mall from the Orlando Corporation.
The total cost of the acquistion was $108 million.
Lambton Mall is situated on 48 acres of land.
Occupancy is 88% national, 8% regional, and 2% local.
Lambton Mall had absolutely no debt while it was owned by Orlando Corporation.
The present owners of Lambton Mall, Primaris REIT, have a $69 million mortgage on the property over a 15 year term.
Net operating income on the property is approximately 7%.
The Canadian Tire store was completed in 1996. The east wing expansion was completed sometime in the early nineties. I haven't yet tracked down the precise year. I'll continue looking for this information and post it when I get it.
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Post by fumanshu on Oct 30, 2006 16:52:04 GMT -5
I do recall that Lambton mall even had to get into the farmers market business. Not while leases we being renewed as you recall.Leases being renewed? That isn't what I said. I said that leases expired and Lambton Mall refused to renew them. Are you familiar with the area where the east/west span of Lambton Mall intersects with the north/south area of the mall? Well that portion of the mall used to contain retailers. It was physically impossible for Lambton Mall to open up that area with the retailers still there. They had to be moved. Some of the retailers in the mall were moved to other areas in the mall. Other retailers were forced to move out of the mall entirely. This was necessary for construction of the expansion to occur. You're missing the big picture. You want to spare Bradley the blame for Sarnia's shortfalls, and heap him with praise for Sarnia's successes. And you just can't do that. You have to take the good with the bad. If you weren't responsible for the bad, then you sure as hell can't take the credit for the good. I did not say that Joe was good. Never have I said that Joe was good and that he was the best choice for Sarnia's new mayor. And you're right, no amount of salesmanship would have kept Dow Chemical in Sarnia. The problem that Dow faced, was beyond Sarnia's control. They could not get a steady supply of raw materials to their local site. And it wasn't for lack of trying. They most certainly did try. It just wasn't to be, and the head office in Michigan decided to pull the plug on the Sarnia operations. As for Bayer, I have little familiarity with that story. I don't know why Bayer decided to exit the Sarnia area, but I do know that it had everything to do with economics. It always has to do with economics. And again, you're right about selling the area and closing the deal being entirely different matters. However, sitting in your office and waiting for opportunity to knock at your door is a losing proposition. Fortune favours the bold. And the city has to take some initiative in bringing investment to the area. If you build it, they don't always come. But if you don't build it, they definitely won't come. It's really pretty simple. Boushy would have been good for mayor? He has contacts and knows how to play the game? What? Let me refresh your memory. David Boushy was a one term Member of Provincial Parliament. He served as a backbencher under the Mike Harris Conservative government. The Harris government was responsible for more downloading and funding cuts than any other provincial government in recent history. Both healthcare and social programs suffered under Harris' leadership. While the Harris government did win re-election, the local Tory incumbent, Dave Boushy, was defeated. Sarnia/Lambton broke from its traditional bellweather status and elected the Liberal Caroline DiCocco. Dave Boushy may know how to play the game, we're just trying to figure out exactly which game he's playing. While Mr. Boushy sat as an MPP, he was routinely criticised for doing absolutely nothing. Many local residents charged him with being unresponsive to the will and wishes of the people. In my opinion, the man doesn't even deserve a seat on city council, let alone the mayor's office. And rhetoric from Joe Murray? Welcome to the game, my friend. If Joe Murray speaks rhetoric, he learned it from Mayor Mike Bradley. Mr. Bradley is an old hand at the game of rhetoric.
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Post by leisha1 on Oct 31, 2006 7:56:12 GMT -5
I respect your comments, You started me thinking about Boushy and what I saw last night at the library candidates meeting you are right about him. He left Frobisher to answer questions about city issues. Frobisher was really impressive.
I guesss you know more about the mall as I only saw what I saw as an outsider.
These debates are real good as without them most of us whould vote for names we have heard about, not for people we know. I voted for Joe and AMG last time, and may not have voted for Frobisher this time. Mathew, Bob MaCarthy Glenn Makinnon and Trothen look worthy of a vote.
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Post by Glenn MacKinnon on Oct 31, 2006 9:59:19 GMT -5
Well thank you for the vote of confidence. I ran in the 2003 election and I was made to feel because I was in my 30's I wasn't worthy of the position, well I am still in my 30's and I hear the winds of change blowing. Some youth would be good on council, for a long time there have been some of the same people on council, I think it is time for someone else to have a try at it.
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Post by Dean Robinson on Oct 31, 2006 10:57:59 GMT -5
Your recollections of Lambton Mall aren't consistent with mine at all. Do you remember Woolco being an anchor store? Farmer's market business? When did Lambton Mall enter the farmer's market business? Here's some quick information about Lambton Mall. Lambton Mall is the largest shopping mall in Sarnia, with 629,000 square feet. Lambton Mall has three anchor stores: WalMart, Canadian Tire, and Sears. Lambton Mall also has two tenants leasing more than 15,000 square feet: Tepperman's and Toys R Us. Lambton Mall had 99% occupancy as of December 31, 2005. Lambton Mall will not see more than 7% of its gross lease expiry dates expire over the next five years. Lease expiry dates for the five major lessee's are as follows: Sears - July 2022 WalMart - May 2021 Canadian Tire - October 2016 Tepperman's - April 2008 Toys R Us - October 2016 Lambton Mall was completed in 1970. In December 2005, the Primaris Real Estate Investment Trust acquired Lambton Mall from the Orlando Corporation. The total cost of the acquistion was $108 million. Lambton Mall is situated on 48 acres of land. Occupancy is 88% national, 8% regional, and 2% local. Lambton Mall had absolutely no debt while it was owned by Orlando Corporation. The present owners of Lambton Mall, Primaris REIT, have a $69 million mortgage on the property over a 15 year term. Net operating income on the property is approximately 7%. The Canadian Tire store was completed in 1996. The east wing expansion was completed sometime in the early nineties. I haven't yet tracked down the precise year. I'll continue looking for this information and post it when I get it. do you think that with the new Super Wallmart leaving the mall it will have a negative affect. in the daily flow of traffic that frequents it (the Lambton Mall)
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Post by fumanshu on Oct 31, 2006 11:41:26 GMT -5
To answer Dean's question, I honestly don't know. I don't think that anyone can say for certain. But I will offer some of what I think on that matter.
i) There is no entrance from the mall into the present WalMart store, so patrons of the present WalMart are not required to enter the mall in order to get to WalMart.
ii) The vast majority of retailers situated in the mall cater to a vastly different demographic than that of WalMart.
iii) The presence of WalMart in the area does not appear to have had any negative impact on other Mall retailers historically.
Personally, I think that the new Super Walmart will have minimal impact on the flow of mall patrons. But this is really nothing more than a guess.
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Post by fumanshu on Oct 31, 2006 12:11:35 GMT -5
Well thank you for the vote of confidence. I ran in the 2003 election and I was made to feel because I was in my 30's I wasn't worthy of the position, well I am still in my 30's and I hear the winds of change blowing. Some youth would be good on council, for a long time there have been some of the same people on council, I think it is time for someone else to have a try at it. In all fairness, the present mayor was only 33 years old when he entered municipal politics. And that was what? 21 years ago? So I don't think your age should prove much of a detriment to your campaign. With the limited exposure I've had to your campaign, I am rather impressed with how you carry yourself. You present yourself as an intelligent and well grounded individual. Your message could use a little honing and you could probably play up your strengths a little more, but I really see no reason why you shouldn't get elected. Also, I feel that Carlos Murray looks very respectable in a suit and tie. A huge improvement over the tie-dye t-shirt and drunkard appearance that he has presented in the past. His message needs a lot of honing and he needs to be brought back to Earth somewhat, but I see no reason why Carlos shouldn't be mayor. I'm hoping that Carlos will avoid using the zero-impact props in the next candidates debate and stay on message. People expect cheap shots and stupid remarks from Carlos, so he should avoid those at all costs.
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Post by leisha1 on Oct 31, 2006 14:32:11 GMT -5
Patricia and I liked Glenn and we have him on our list.
Calos looks good he should at least run for council. I like some of his ideas and he sure would blow the wistle if someone was out of line. For Mayor ...not!
Glenn, Sarnia need some cultural support our mayor and our MPP a music teacher, is never seen at any local events. Oh yes she is the Culture minister!!!!
I don't know what AMG was thinking when she allowed the vote on the budget. Wheter she thought she would catch Bradley off guard or what. It seens the table turned against her, made her look like she can't be a good chairperson.
At least as Mike Keltch and Bradley say, they will send it back when it goes to council!
On 16 Million as a budget they are squabbling about $200,000 possible overtime. Last year they went over by more than that in overtime. To me it is better to budget too much and not go over! They had a good excuse with the serial rapist on the loose, at least they caught him for the extra bucks!
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Post by Dean Robinson on Oct 31, 2006 15:28:26 GMT -5
Id also like to support the boys in blue..
It is well known that there is a Speed epidemic here in Sarnia the dealers of this poison seem to have taken advantage of the Location.
The City police are doing a great job in fighting this. but to make arrest and have the charges stick, it takes overtime most raids must happen at nite..
good job Guys
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Post by fumanshu on Oct 31, 2006 16:16:31 GMT -5
The budgeted overtime amount is a sticking point.
There are five officers that are apparently on sick leave. Other officers will have to fill the void. This could cause a situation where overtime is necessary. However, the city police should be realizing a savings on the salaries of those off on disability. Insurance should be paying the incomes of those five persons... not the taxpayer.
Also, the city police had issues to contend with last year that they don't have this year... namely the sex predator that has since been apprehended. It is not rational to expect the same overtime expenditure that the police experienced last year. And it is insane to expect that overtime expenditure to increase this year.
I support the boys in blue when they do their job and uphold the law... When they do not do their jobs and uphold the law, they do not deserve support... they deserve to be tarred and feathered.
And that's the way it's going to be.
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